Field Crops Webinar Series - Controlling Troublesome Weeds
March 12, 2018
MSU Extension Field Crops Webinar Series
Controlling Resistant and Troublesome Weeds
Say good evening one last time welcome to four session in our Mr extension field crops were serious Tonight's topic is controlling resistant and troublesome wheels with Dr Crisp regular weed management specialist with the most you thank you so as Jim said basically we're going to do is talk about controlling troublesome weeds and challenging means and a lot of that really comes down to looking at some of the purpose I resisted we challenges and really what I wanted today is focus on some of the things that we're really starting to see emerge as huge issues in particularly some of those weeds that we're seeing as challenges in soybeans some to spend a little bit of time talking about why some of these weeds are becoming more of a problem as well as what are possibly some of our management strategies we can do to take care of those and as you can see from my title I'm really going to focus on quite a bit on of course we don't Mira's tell because that is one of the huge issues that we are seeing and as you can see from this picture route we've over the last several years have seen a lot of where sweeter mirrors tell issues in soybeans and pretty much you can drive anywhere in the state and you will probably see at least one field that looks like so it is it is a major concern as we look at. Thinking of ways that we can actually manage this particular we so when we look out for Sweden I kind of break it down into there are some management challenges with this we just based on some of the things that it's been able to do as far as develop herbicide resistance and then we'll talk about some of the other issues that have made it much more of a management challenge. As far as horse weed there are several herbicides that were sweet can no longer be controlled by basically resistance issues and you can see. Course we different populations have developed resistance to several types of herbicides and we'll talk about more of the ones that we're seeing in Michigan but you can see that right now there's at least five different purposes side of action groups and you can just see from this chart most of the herbicides we use are based in these different groups and each particular group actually has a group number and those group numbers can be found on your herbicide labels as well as on several of their publications so just to kind of give you an example of those and in particular if you look at this particular show chart you'll see life is a listed here and that's a group one here besides So as we talk about life it's a resistance a lot of times will be tight referring to it as a Group Nine her side and then one of the other ones that we talk about quite a bit is on resistance to the alehouse inhibitors and those are group two herbicide so examples of those are things like class that first rate as well as some of our I mean I was on herbicides like Raptor in pursuit but as I mentioned before around the U.S. there are different populations that have developed resistance to some of these herbicides in addition to some of these populations being resistant to only one group of these herbicides we have multiple resistance issues that are also occurring and you can see some examples and I'll talk a little bit about what we're actually seeing in Michigan so with a lot of our Michigan horse weed populations we're seeing resistance to not only going to say but we're also seeing resistance to what we consider the L.S.O. who are so things like first rate that we used to be able to control or suite with and then again most a lot of our populations the state are showing up to be multipliers resistant so resistant to both of those groups of herbicides The other thing that we have found over the last couple years is actually a population that has shown resistance to the herbicide paraquat. Are commonly sold as for mock someone in there and then there are several other generics so that is a big concern we haven't seen this as a resistance issue in a lot of our fuel crops but we are seeing it in some of our Christmas tree plantations that are along the west side of the state so that is another concern that we have as we start thinking about how course we actually. Put on C.N.N. We'll talk about some of those challenges and how those populations can spread. In fact I just wanted to give you some numbers about different types of the populations that have been submitted to the I miss you diagnostic clinic and looking back at the two thousand and sixteen results basically there were thirty seven Horse wincing impulse that were sudden So again not everybody sunning in their samples but it were we're getting a good feel for what types of resistance are showing up of those thirty seven samples a human seventy five percent of them showed up to be life as a resistant and forty six almost fifty percent of them had that multiple resistance of both like to say and the Allison have errors and there are very few that showed up with no resistance so again this is pretty troublesome as we start thinking about this that is showing up in a lot of our not only soybean fields but in several of our other field crops. This is just kind of an example of where samples have been submitted from in Michigan and you can see here any of the counties that have an orange square there has been samples that have been submitted and then they have been confirmed either life as a resistant or Also glad to see no loss resistant so it's not saying that if there's an orange square in that county that there isn't anybody again these are just kind of give me an example of hey this is getting to be a widespread problem throughout Michigan. And just as a small sampling that's been shown up at the diagnostic clinic for simple or for testing. One of the other challenges that we do see with management of course we had arrears tell is basically the seed production and spread so not only is herbicide resistance an issue but just the nature of this plant and that it produces a lot of seed in general we see about two hundred thousand seeds pre-planned that is produced and one of the things that makes this one of very difficult to keep under control is how it is actually dispersed pretty much we do see that it is a wind blown seed so you can see by a kind of a closeup picture of one of those seeds they do kind of have this. Attachment to it so it's basically blown throughout the area and there's actually been a lot of studies of what the dispersal of the seed how far can move and that's one of the things I want to share with you back in two thousand and six over ten years ago as horsemeat was starting to become more and more of a problem particularly as quite the state resistance was showing up on the East Coast and there was some actual work looking at how far that horse we'd see could be dispersed and this is just kind of a mock up of what our atmosphere looks like and one of the things that shields it all it did was they actually took a. Kind of a remote controlled plane that they could put up in the air and basically quacked samples of different types of things where there was pollen or so forth but they actually collected of course weed seeds and one of the things that they actually found is they found first seed basically anywhere from point zero three to point zero eight miles up in what we call that planetary boundary layer and as you do some predictions looking at how fast wind can actually travel in this area wind speeds carefully be up to forty five miles per hour so if you do some code. Elations basically that's telling you that horse we've seen could actually be dispersed over three hundred miles in a single event so it's really showing how quickly the spread of this we can happen as you look at maps of showing where life is a series of software suite is throughout the U.S. you see that almost every state does have it so again it's one of those weeds so it's no matter how hard you can try to keep it out because of its dispersal mechanism by wind it does have a tendency to move throughout. The state fields counties and so forth one of the other challenges that we're really starting to see as a major challenge is this continued emergence So what I have here on the slide you can see at the top and at the bottom these are two pictures that I took from the same field on Argus sixteen one the top one actually had some control strategies in place and the bottom line you can see there are actually plants that are starting to produce seed if you look closely at that top photo you can see some plant silica about four inches tall just starting to pull to you have some smaller ones but I'm going to show you a close up of this and you can see we actually have some pretty small rosettes that are starting to come up so that's really telling us that we're seeing this continuous emergence of course weed and that's another thing that really makes it very difficult to manage because as you start thinking about a management plan in trying to think of well how can I control the ones that I need to control early in the season and as we get these ones that come up later I'm pretty much by that time we're done with our herbicide treatments there's not very many options we do have so it's trying to think how can we do an overall management strategy so as we think about these management challenges obviously it does make course we had one of those tougher to control weeds. One of the things that we did this last year is we wanted to just kind of keep track of those that were sweet emerges throughout the season. As typically we usually think of course we does what we would consider kind of a fall in you all or an early spring in your will in that most of time we would see emergence either in the fall were early spring but as you start seeing some of these issues occurring we're really seeing the same ridges throughout the season so it one of the sites that we had we basically put out these little squares and then every week or so or two weeks whenever we were up at the site we would actually go and count the number of horse we'd plants and emerged in the squares and then we would pull them so we wouldn't recount and if you look at this chart you can basically see that our highest emergence was actually more towards the first part of July so our peak emergence was basically happening anywhere from the last week of June all week through July so again the summer gins pattern is really kind of shifted in is making this we need much more of an challenge to control it so those are also like a fall people get carried through the winter or something there too and say look you maybe had two weeks in your calendar there yeah so if you look at this and I guess and this is one season and basically after soybean harvest we did not go back to the site but as you can see here towards the end middle September we're starting to see more emergence and I would expect that that would have continued on until the temperature started to drop so generally we'll see that all emergence and then an early spring but one of the things that was really consistent throughout this year is how much it just continued to emerge throughout the season. So what I thought I would do is really kind of focus on what are some of the ways that we can actually manage this weed and really it's because it has been such a challenge and are really starting to see this as more and more of a problem throughout the state and one of the calls that I constantly get is I didn't see this week last year all the sudden it's in our soil my savings what do I do so what I really want to do is just kind of go through some of the stops and some of the strategies to. Really controlling this week as I said in the past we've thought of this more as a fall or early spring so it's usually kind of considered a note to weed but with this emergency room the season we really need to be think you know that is just what we can show up in any sort of tillage system. When we look at management steps there's a few things that I want you to think about obviously when we talk about good we control strategies we want to make sure that we control those weaves prior to planning and that's particularly important with we're sweet because of some of the options that we actually have we're very limited on what we can actually use for control so we want to make sure that we're controlling that emerged horse weed prior to planning one of the ways we can do it obviously is with tillage when I talk about tillage really what I'm talking about is making sure that we're able to disrupt those plants and basically pick them up so what King at something like more of a field cultivator or something that like a shank that will rip those up and are really looking at some sort of a uniform disturbance in those top few inches as we've seen people shift towards more better vertical tillage units really those things are not able to really disrupt that plant because all they're doing is possibly slicing it or moving you know over and we're not getting that good taking of that particular plant so that's one of those things that again tillage will work but we it's got to be the right type. Tillage tool in order to basically control those plants the other option we have is if you're Noto or reduced to which the system is really working out what are some of our effective burn down treatments and in some cases depending on how happy of the population you have that might actually require two passes some people work at those passes probably trying to start out with a good job or now on treatment in that case we're looking at trying to control those ones that came up later in the season and basically trying to give us a chance to be more uniform on a leader half in the spring. And as we start thinking about trying to mentor Swede not only do we need to control it before we plant residual herbicides are really important to make sure that we're getting some residual control later in the season in trying to basically prevent some of those leader emerging plants from coming up one thing I did want to point out here in I'm not suggesting that people completely throw away the whole load still aspect but what I wanted to show you was just a picture that so one of our extension educators Paul Gross up a notable account any shared with me we had talked about some of the different strategies and one of the growers at one of the meetings you know I no longer plough I want to look awesome and see what actually happens and you can see in the soybean field that basically there are herbicide treatments were all the same but you have the snow still strip in the back and you can see we're there's a lot of. Horse with that as a merge but we're a mobile or plowed he was able to bury the seed and you can see that really there's not a lot of there's really no mirror still in the field and the main reason for that is that Mir still seed is really small and it doesn't emerge from very deep so I'm not suggesting that people go to morrow. Mobile or plough but I'm going to show you a picture of really how deep it can emerge from so again some of that like those fill cultivators are a lot of the combination tools where we can actually period that seed that will be helpful so this is just kind of a picture showing as a display of where the seeds actually emerge from most of time we see that horsemeat seeds are coming up from the soil surface or very close to it so if you look at this new Think of like a quarter of a son a metre which is very small only three percent of course weed seed will Germany from that and if you get it down to a half a centimeter again you know somewhere to like a quarter of an inch on those horse we just don't have enough power to him are sure that soil so again that's where some of that tillage really does help in bearing some of that and one of the things with horse we'll see it is it is fairly short lived so if you can kind of get it under control it does help from that standpoint but again you're constantly just remember you're getting those see it's worse isn't from neighbors and so forth the only thing I want to talk about is again we have a fact of burnout treatments and I just want to talk about some of the things we need to think about if we're doing those bring down treatments. First of all is horse weed size basically we're looking at horse we passed the implied when it's when it's mall so a lot of times in the fall we see this rose that stage at the top and obviously that's what we usually see with a lot of Farmer Jance when we start seeing some of that more spring emergence later in the season we can see the horse we plants might look a little bit different they might start to look like they're already starting to bolt but really what we need to do is focusing on getting that timing when. That horse wheat is last and four inches tall so the one in the bottom corner is probably a little bit too tall as far as trying to get very good control and a lot of times one of the things that we do see is people don't really realize it's a problem until it's already up above the sleeping canopy and a lot of times it is very difficult to control with when it gets any sort of sort of size on it as I mentioned before some people look at using follow pite herbicides to kind of start their management program if you're using a ball herbicide application Basically if it doesn't mean you're not going to need one spraying again because we have the spring emergence Noma even if we put a residual in the fall we will still see some emergence but what those fall treatments really do is kind of reduce that variability from the different size plants that we might get in the spring so it does help from this standpoint of kind of starting a little bit more on an even keel with all spring treatments generally work out thought for treatments is trying to go baby a little bit on the cheaper side. Two forty is one of those ones that we might look at in particular to forty Aster from one to two pints sharp and has worked fairly well again in freezing sharp and we need to have a mathlete at Cedar Hill in there and then with our fall treatments again we can use DI camber and it won't matter that what soybean type we use in the spring so we can These are for all treatments so we're looking at trying to be a little bit an expensive so we can to forty or die Kimber kind of on. The more inexpensive side in many cases we would be applying any of these products with something like a good life a c to help pick up control some of the other weeds for example if there's a day in dandelion out there or some other perennials on that life to say would help in picking up control of those we species. So here are just some of our potential options from the spring side so we mention two forty before again and that's one that has worked fairly well we do see in some cases and cooler weather particular if we got some variability in high we might see some more variable control when we look at using two forty or looking at using the Astra formulation in the main reason for that is from the application to the time of planning there are some restrictions with the as your formulation we're looking at using a pint and then basically we need seven days before we clean it so again many of these applications we're going to include going to say to help pick up control some of the other one species another when species that are in other options we have are sharpened again the one ounce right in the spring basically we comply fully up to planning that application needs to have a mathlete at Sidwell and there another option we do have is something like liberty but. And we can increase the rate of that there are some new able rates they. Basically we're looking at anywhere from thirty six to forty three fluid ounces in general we see Liberty working better with our in crop applications and we have links live in small talk about few minutes we also have a new product that's out there this is a group for her side so it is a growth regular herbicide like a two forty or die camera it's called out for that can be applied at one ounce per acre Again this would also need a methylated seed oil and you would apply it probably with a wife a seat. The one key thing about this is a senior herbicide and there is a application to planning restriction and that's fourteen days so depending on where you're at in the state this may or may not be an option again we need that longer window between application in planning so maybe if you're working at an early spring application this might be another option that you have and again it is a newer product and it is particularly good on on are resistant. Mares to what we're sweet. With the runner pretty to extend soybeans out there obviously we do have to I can buy that we can use there are only certain die Campbell formulations that are labeled for use in the run a pretty to extend soybeans and generally will be looking at half pound rate which would be equivalent to twenty two ounces the extender Macs are facts opinion or twelve point eight ounces of ingenious So again those are some of are our strategies with that I can but we are working you know having to have the run a pretty to extend soybeans but as we look at. When things I'd share some of the work that we did this last year looking at how well some of these different treatments worked is are some of our burn down applications twenty one days after planning and again we did this in an extend So I mean system you can see. Again a very very resistant like this or like to say resistant Worsley population so only about twenty percent control but the doc camera the two forty the sharp and in the Liberty are provided excellent control twenty one days after treatment where we started to see some separation was a little bit later so some of these products do have a little bit or residual control in particular I can sharpen so you can see they were still holding pretty well but as we start to see new emergence things like two forty Aster we start to see the last control and then with the liberty we can also again there is no research will so we are seeing the. New emergence that would happen there one of the things that we have seen is the and some cases if we combine two of the it's herbicides we're probably getting a little bit more consistent control so here are some options for that one other thing I do want to point out is a matter of years and we'll talk about that residual activity but that does root really well with take mixtures with liberty or even with remarks on in helping control resistant mirrors. So as I mentioned those residuals are very important if you look at this picture these are some parts of we had from a couple of years ago this is looking at roundup plus two forty and it had a burned down application and we had very good burn down control but as you can see a very high. Were sweetener some population in this is all new emergence after that was controlled by putting a residual like Mattress reason or the all Suncor you can see that that does help in control it's not one hundred percent effective but you do see that it's much better than if you did not have a reason to all her side in the tank when we look at what our residual options are we're basically limits. What we call two different sets of action groups one of those are the group five herbicides and in this case that is really much abuse and so it means in general depending how your soil type this we try to push the rate of metric use on a little bit higher and save your souls we want to be a little bit on the lower side but those higher rates are really going to be helpful in trying to give us some prolong season control so we're looking at six to eight ounces there's a lot of pre-mix out there things like foundry canopy that have metric is a noun so I can just kind of check out what some of the different products are there's a lot of different generic products. Much abuse and again that's kind of one of those all herbicides that we is to a lot of kind of went away from but as we start to see more of these resistance issues it is becoming more popular because it does have some effect on what Wattenburg life a series of weeds the other types of herbicides that we can use our the group fourteen her besides from a research will standpoint when we look at those herbicides we're basically working out things like of our type product or from Yox isn't so there's a lot of products out there there's a lot of pre-mixed as that contain Balor and then also the SO punters on products those also will have good research will control of. Course weed so basically RB authority type brand products and in some cases we do see some tinctures of the group five with the group for teens and are premature is that work really well there are some restrictions if you are using fourteen herbicides in deciding who you sharpen as your burn down since it is a group fourteen so just be aware of some of those different restrictions. From a residual control side a lot of times we're seeing combinations of those residuals being more effective than maybe one or the other by itself so it just really kind of depends and as we talk a. But resistance management the more effective herbicide sites of action that we have in the tank the better off we're going to be from developing the resistance and also trying to manage the resistance problems that we have so from a residual side again we're basically stuck with a group of five fourteen's with a lot of the resistance issues we have expression with the airless resistance and life savers. With so those are kind of the mean strategies we have is really starting cleaning How many good research will products but as I mentioned before we do see some of these. Populations that continue to emerge particularly in some of our not all systems and when we have what are just populations out there like these it is sometimes not going to hold out for the entire season and we ran into this in two thousand and sixteen this is a trial that we had looking at trying to manage life as a resistant or sweet and looking at two forty S. or burn down products with like a C. and then with one of these residual products and in some cases we looked at the pre-mix years and individuals by itself and this kind of shows you is the time quarter's what happened prior control stamp way so early on good control with the residuals as it went out further we saw that our plus much abuse and or Spartan alone at a high rate or the authority M.T.C. which would again be a pre-mixed year of the Spartan plus measure use and provided the bass control by June twenty seventh which was about sixty days after treatment basically we only had one product that was what I would consider even a factor of a now happen to be the authority on Tuesday but even come by out to our guests we're really start to see a break so in some of these conditions it is a little bit scary when we look at these high populations and maybe we're not getting that research will control so what are some of those options that we can do you and this is just one of the things that we did this last year in two thousand and seventeen and this is looking at we're under pretty to extend soybeans and looking at some different burn down strategies whether he would. Die camp or in this case we used to extend the max to forty. As one sharpen for liberty and you can see the blue bars are those different burn down treatments alone and you can see again very highly resistant. Mirrors tell population when we added matter of years and for that reason to all you can see we had very good control so that residual control really helps in that control and again this is on July fifth and that's again where we really start to see that kind of that region so it did hold out pretty well for this in two thousand and seven. One of the the issues that we do have is if we have resistance to the Ls and have errors or life to say. If we're in run or pretty soybeans or not John. I mean system we just really don't have anything that we can control or pick up control or post or merges with and so even so that's where it kind of leads us to looking at maybe if you're looking in an area where you've got some very hyped or sweet populations maybe considering some of the alternative options and those alternative options are some of. Other herbicide resistant so even traits so in this case we're talking about things like Liberty link soybeans and then also the new runner pretty to extend soybeans. If we are using those we're still wanting you to make sure that you're starting off with a good burn down or get tillage and making sure that you have that residual herbicide down because again we're trying to stop that continuum urgence of those plants so this is a study that we did this last year looking at. Mare seller horse weed control and liberty link soybeans working at several different burn down options the first two bars are of sharpening sharpened plus much abuse and the next three are looking at two forty asterisk or burned down. Forty Aster plus authority on Tuesday and then two forty Aster plus of our plus much abuse and so again a very similar type of complex and then the next ones were looking at a war with either the authority M.T.C. or valor plus Metra Buzan which would be very similar and you can see again our round up burn down very low control this is at our post application timing so this is actually later in the season so again with it you're forty alone we would have had good control for about twenty days and then we don't have that research will that we need by itself so again you're seeing good control by including that reason and then we did see a little bit of research will control here with a sharp and. The next thing that we see is. What our control was on August sixteenth basically when we followed that up with one application post written celebrity so. You know basically we had very very good control after that liberty application so again starting out with that could burn down. As well as making sure that we have a residual and then following that up with every application was very good control and you can see if we were just looking in relying on but really. It was it was much less control than what we saw with kind of the full program. This is just a picture showing and we were really we were in thirty intro soybeans basically to really test these different programs so you can see here on the left hand side we have the just burn down of run up. To really control that we had a lot of weeds of this get control on the right hand side we had run a plus to four D. class the reason is that all three I'm choosy and then follow that up with thirty two ounces we're pretty so very contingent. And that helped throughout the season so this is on August sixteenth we were back in mid September and looked just as good and pretty much we saw that with any of the effective for nouns and research also we had really good at good control at harvest. Another. Trial that we did was looking at it in the extend so it means and then these are some of the same the same sides that we showed before with the reason jewel and then what we did is follow that up with a router and the extender max for it I can application and basically had very good control at the end of the season and it didn't matter whether it was one of the ones that had a reason to or not so we had some good control greater than ninety five percent but again that's relying on that I can application leader in the season and there I'll talk a little bit about what might be some of the issues with that so. In this case we're looking at another trial we're really looking at I can buy in the burn down. Only following it up with some of our different residuals. Or with our residuals and then just following up with a round up application in this year we had very good luck with those types of our products so again it's kind of looking at the same reason jewels of on the team mixtures authority empty easier pre-mix years or valor Plus much of years and they all worked well and here's just kind of a comparison of some of those and again we're looking at just putting that I camera in the burn down and again these are on the run a pretty to extend soybean So we're not relying on that post emergence application of extra numerics but we have some very good reason to authors that held and I think we do get a little bit of research will control from that extender Max that does help from the mares talk control side and again this is our guest and these help through to community or excuse me to harvest. One of the things that I thought I would spend a little bit of time. Talking about as I bring up the run a pretty to extend system because there was a lot of press about this and specially during the summer of this last year with some different issues so I wanted to just touch base on some of the things that we need to be thinking about if you're thinking about growing around a pretty to extend soybeans in particular thinking about using these to help manage some of our herbicide resistant we so one thing I wanted to do is talk a little bit about how that once went so we look at two thousand and seventeen there's a couple things that stood out and this is really not necessarily from a Michigan side but basically from a U.S. wide side if you look at how the launch went in two thousand and seventeen basically we saw that there were very few issues with product performance so basically we control was very good with those die camp applications and the run a pretty to extend soybeans and again remember the run a pretty to extent soybeans give you resistance to die camera and also to like to say. The one concern was is we were starting this or there was a lot of issues with Target movement and this is in particular as we work across us some of the share with you few different slides of some of the complaints that happened in two thousand and seventeen so here's a slide that was put together by one of my colleagues from the University of Missouri Kevin Bradley and this is basically where he talks or got information from our state departments of Throughout most of the soybean growing region were there was extern So it means years and if you look at this you can see down here there's a total of two thousand seven hundred six complaints die camp or related complaints that were investigated by the State Departments of Agriculture. Some of those states for example you probably heard a lot about Arkansas in Missouri you can see nine hundred eighty six complaints and Arkansas three hundred ten in Missouri two hundred forty five in Illinois so there was a lot that were reported to there's departments of bad also Tennessee one hundred thirty S. here in Michigan we had very few complaints that were reported to the department of a some of the other states but again we were probably not using as much or if the extensive means were planted there may not have been as much tight camera applique or applications made particularly in crop I think most of ours were made at the beginning the season and if we look back at some of the issues that happened a lot of those were with some of the later applications to control later merging things like water has potentially later merging hoarsely and also later merging POMERY America. Some of the complaints were related to issues the homeowner saw also for example with trees and gardens. So you just show you what that would look like as far as tomato plants you can see a soybean field there and there was also issues with in yards you see this tree here. Then years are also very susceptible of this was in Tennessee. Probably the number one complaint was to soybean and so you can search strictly sensible herbs sensitive so that's one of the issues that we see in fact here's kind of the estimates from the extension lead scientist throughout the States about the number of acres of soybeans or possibly impacted by Campbell does that mean that there was a you your boss but it was showing some sort of symptomology and you could see that that was at three point three million acres so what are some of the things that actually happened one of the things was there are some very strict application require ments for using documents so I mean. And I think in general some applicators were pretty. LAX and didn't take the products labels too seriously and I think that's because they think hey we've been spraying around or haven't had these issues so I think with a lot of these products that people have been used more recently specially if we get newer applicators there are some things we need to worry about some of the common mistakes that happen is particle drift from. Camera moving on to other fields some of that had to do with using the wrong now Zal there is only certain nozzles to be used and again I'll spend a little bit of time talking about these things boom height was too high if the boom height is too high we have more issues with respect to high spray or travel speed the biggest thing might have been applying it when the winds it's were high mix last year's label said fifteen miles per hour and that would include cost this year we're looking at a ten mile per hour cap also that you know. There are buffers and then the biggest thing that I think people had issues with is they didn't realize that the buffers do not protect sensitive crop when it is blowing when the wind is blowing towards that sense of crops so again basically new applications happening when. Wind is blowing towards a sensitive crop other issues that happen spray system contamination basically not getting the spray or clean now or some of the other issues or other things that would be involved in filling up spray or other things like possibly happened were to Lety due to illegal applications. There's a lot more die Kimmer products that have higher volatility so for example if you look at the old Benbow it's a lot more volatile than some of these newer products the other thing is there you cannot use ammonium saw feet with a camera because what that does help. It basically makes a product more volatile so those are some of the issues so and then some of the team issues and stuff so again it's very important to realize what is labelled So these are these are completely different types of labels you can only use what is on those labels and that's including T. mixtures and additives and again. Adding a mass is illegal because basically what that does is makes the product more volatile So a question from John about a related question about water quality and how that might affect herbicide application is really asking about ph we're going to say. So ph with life to say in general when you add life to see it that does what were the PH of the water so a lot of times you start to see a kind of a buffering slipper excuse me a buffering and if we have like hard water like with calcium and so forth they have a lot of cattle iron So what we generally do with life to say is we want to add money because what that does is counteract so scared ions so you don't see the positives from account C M tying up the native from apply for say acid so that's in general why we're always recommending using something like an ammonium softly to help counteract that issue with that I can but we don't want to do that because what that does is it takes potentially some of the salts or some of the additives that are helping keeping that down so that's one of the things that we need to be aware of so for using that Campbell place like to say we do not want to lose our ammonium soft and there is only labeled added of second be used so what we're looking for in two thousand and eighteen because of some of the issues that happen in two thousand and seventeen there are some requirements that are new Basically the E.P.A. came out in October and sat hate you know what we only had three products that are registered for us and those run are pretty to extend So I mean. Those are going to be the only three products that are still registered and they are not going to be restricted use pesticides so if your point i camera to soybeans it can be only in Genia you know Center Max you need to be a certified applicator or work under a certified applicator another thing that is required is there are some training sessions that need to be that you need to attend and. In general these are happening around the state basically saying that I'm aware of how to apply that camera and those training sessions. There are still a few laughed and those are being put on by the manufacturers either months you know or be a Asaf of some of those products or just if you're thinking about us and I can you haven't been to one of those trainings that's very important you do that from our side from an issue basically our big recommendation is to make sure that you've got all those right label recommendations there are websites that you need to follow again these are part of the label and basically if you're not following those labels it's a direct violation of both state and federal law when we look at trying to use DI kamma and soybeans I think the safest bet that we have is to apply to I can't really are in the season where there it's as a pre-planned for help of control of mares Taylor or sweet peer mergence or if you're going to use a post emergence you want to be very early proposed and really the reason for that is it reduces the potential for contact with some of our more susceptible or sensitive plants another thing to consider is where you're at if you were close to very susceptible plants whether it's been your tomatoes so forth it's probably best just not to use document potentially work for an alternative option like maybe using a weapon he went system. And as I said before really if they're working out using dye can. I think it's more better suited for the early season of course we are mere sole control. The biggest thing that we want to make sure that so you're aware of is making sure that you communicate with your neighbors as we look at Michigan we're very diverse and varied very integrated and you could see just as an overview some of these fields we could have all sorts of different types of plants in there so that's one of our strengths so if you're using. Or thinking about using it please communicate with your neighbors make sure that they don't have a susceptible crop or if you're going run a pretty to extend soybeans you're thinking about growing or a pine I can talk to your neighbor and see what types of soybeans he has he may be willing to switch to an extent varieties so there wouldn't be any issues there looking at what we have as far as our kind of major acreage and farm gave all you you can see anything that's highlighted in yellow is susceptible to dye so in general corn and wheat are the only two crops that are of high value or of high acreage that are not susceptible so many of our vegetables are fruits field crops and again soybeans are extremely sensible sensitive if they're not extend so he means. And then in some cases if these things are whether we have drifts or take in sea emanation there applied to some of these other crops a lot of these crops do not have tolerances so once himself processors will not accept the crop so for example sugar beets if there was a taint contamination and it was found that I can but was applied those sugar beets would be lost because there are no tolerances so probably the biggest thing is making sure that we're protecting our sensitive areas from crops from our sensory berries and crops from our target I can be exposure Well there's stricter chain contamination and ultimately that is the responsibility of the applicant. So if you're going to be applying I can it is your responsibility to make sure that it does not. Cost impact on any off target species. So one of the things I wanted to bring up is we do have or I miss you we control guy that can be purchased from the I miss you stores or the bookstore you can find not and order those online the other thing that we do we have that online am issue weeks dot com So if you go there you can look at the we control guide and we do have a whole session section basically talking about the best way to use the dye camera and the runner pretty to extend it also really highlight some of the issues or things that need to be done as far as using that and all the label requirements and again it's extremely important to not only refer to this but to refer to the label for you for that use also want to mention that we do happen that we control guide or you can go to Hamish the weeds dot com basically a fact sheet that talks about some of the best methods for controlling or sweeter mirrors tell and in addition to that we do has some other fact sheets that really focus on control of water have POMERY and some of the other tougher to control weeds that we have so I think with that I think I'm in a stop right now because we have about nine minutes so here's information on how to request special applicator reserve kitchen credit so if you fall jumped out your browser to respond to the survey trying to find zoom back on your toolbar there or your open zoom window so you can be this information. But we are we have a difference from last year almost all seem to be getting used to it at this point now that we're four sessions in but rather than emailing Nicole you have in the past recrossed a set up again or credits we are now filling out a survey all tricks see. Can see the survey there I can also stop sharing this in a second it but that into the chat in that way you were able to be able to respond that way as well. So I just pasted the link into the chat there so if you. Follow that link I'll take a call tricks and that will allow you to request to set up their credits so what you're putting in on that screen in that survey is. Your name as it appears on your present care licens your email address your license number in then highlight those credits applied well that's private court martial Corps one eighth field crops for Kershaw haters. And then you have to let us know if your question credits for the live carbon or for the record weapon are. And you want to know it too there's been some questions from folks about confirmation of your or even credit requests and the way that's going to work is that semi-colon's receiving those requests five aquatic survey and she is compiling that information what she's going to do is someone serious all done on April first so he's going to send you an email that says Here is the robbers and I have a record of you participating in requesting credits or so at that point after April first of all we confirm all of us credit requests and she'll send those off them guard. If there is some discrepancy about your participation or if there's something that you miss that you want to participate in by the recordings you can do that between April first and April thirtieth to catch up and make sure you got all of your participation complete No if your credit or last minute so I have basically thirty days after the Lives series is complete to finish up any current requests to view those recordings or purposes or requesting credits and to get off so that I will say good night we will see you all next Monday at seven PM or the next session in our series of ya'll enjoyed the presentation and thanks indeed Kristie.