MSU Extension Safe Food & Water

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Transcripts

Speaker 1:

Welcome to Think Food Safety, A podcast on topics that affect the food we eat. Michigan State University Extension educators talk with food industry professionals to provide information and share resources on hot topics and best practices to keep people safe from foodborne illness. Thank you for tuning in. Let's get started and answer those questions that you didn't even know you had. As consumers, we hear about so many different ways we need to keep food safe. Eat cold food cold, cook food to their proper temperature, clean and sanitize, and so many more. So as consumers, how do we assess that growers are doing everything in their power to keep the food they grow safe. And what does that look like? Well, through our discussion today, we hope that you can learn more about food safety on the produce production of things. And how awareness of these practices can help you keep our food safe as well. I'm going to introduce Mariel Borgman, who is a community food systems educator. Mariel, welcome. And if you would explain what your job entails and help us understand how that relates to food safety.

Speaker 2:

Great, Thanks for having me. Well, a community food system educator does a lot of different things. As you can imagine, a food system has a lot of parts to it. But when it comes to produce safety, I work with farms mostly in helping them to design practices and procedures that help keep food safe. And a lot of that is kind of common sense. But it's important to review these things. And there are some things that don't always come to mind that we helped to do some of the education on the farm side. I work a lot of times with both farmers and buyers, especially buyers like schools or hospitals that work with a lot of vulnerable populations, young people, elderly people, sick people. So, it's really, really important that growers are focused on safe production practices to do their part in making sure that they keep not only those people with vulnerable conditions, but everyone who's eating that food. Everyone's keeping safe and healthy.

Speaker 1:

Well, thanks for that explanation. I think that is so important. We don't always think about things like this when we're eating, or shopping and getting food on an individual level. So, I, as a food safety educator with MSU Extension, work with more of the consumer end of it, as far as safe handling practices when we're storing, preparing, serving food, things like that. But you work in food safety certainly as well at the other end of the spectrum or so with the growers and purchasers, as you mentioned too. Ultimately, our goal is to keep food safe and do whatever we can to prevent foodborne illness, which can happen at different steps in that whole spectrum or cycle of food handling. Let's talk about the cost of foodborne illness.

Speaker 2:

I think when it comes to farmers, obviously they're worried about liability from a number of perspectives. So typically they're trying to create the safest food possible because obviously they don't want customers to get sick. They don't want to have their food recalled. They don't want that to be how people associate their business. So, it's definitely from a perspective of not wanting to make customers sick, not wanting to have a bad reputation in the community, but also there's financial implications as well. So, if a farmer has part of their crop contaminated and they have to do a recall or not harvest that, that's a financial issue for them as well. Because any crop that doesn't get sold, that's money that they don't have in their pocket at the end of the day. So they're also really trying to minimize that liability to their bottom line in addition to making sure that they're producing safe food for their customers.

Speaker 1:

Sure. So there's certainly, from their perspective, it's largely liability/financial kind of perspective. And then of course, there's the cost is in people, in lives lost, which may be something related to what has happened on their farm. I mean, certainly there's a whole chain and things change as we handle food.

Speaker 2:

I think farmers are pretty aware of that because of some of those high-profile outbreaks that we've had. And we know we've had some issues with spinach and Romaine, lettuce, and cantaloupe. And those have been traced back to individual farm operations. I know even local farmers have told me that when there's a recall on Romaine lettuce, No one wants to buy Romaine lettuce from any producer, even if it was just traced back to one farm. So, it's definitely an issue that they're pretty aware of, how bad it can affect their business.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I can imagine. I'd like to maybe do a little backtracking now and talk about what we call the Food Safety Modernization Act, otherwise referred to as FISMA. There was a lot of implications and changes that FISMA had when we were talking about our jobs and how we do things as well as farmers. But can you tell me from your perspective what FISMA is? So people have a good understanding of what is being done to help prevent food borne illness.

Speaker 2:

FISMA is a federal law. It was signed in 2011. And it is, the idea behind it, Food Safety Modernization Act, the title, you're right, they're trying to modernize the safety of our food system and really approaching it from a preventative lens versus reactive as issues arise. So, it's all about putting in procedures that will prevent foodborne illness outbreaks from happening at different parts of the supply chain. And that includes produce producers. So, people that grow produce had not been regulated previously. This was the first time that produce growers were ever regulated. So, it's a big change for the industry. And we've been doing a lot of training within MSU Extension to help producers get up to speed with those regulations and what they need to be doing to comply with them. So previously, most of the farm food safety programs for produce growers were all voluntary. And so, you may have heard of a farm going through an audit for their food safety, but that was all driven by a buyer asking them to do that. This is different because it's the federal government and everyone has to comply with it. So that's really, really changed the landscape of food safety on the farm.

Speaker 1:

That sounds pretty impactful and far-reaching as opposed to like what you said before where it was voluntary. Yeah. That would really change the landscape. So, you said it applies to everyone. So basically all produce growers.

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So, all produce growers are subject to the regulations. There are some exemptions. So, if a farm is very small and they are only selling to local markets, they may be excluded from the law. Or they may have some kind of exemption where they have modified requirements. But generally we encourage everyone to learn what's the law. And even if you don't have to comply with it, these are all practices that you should be doing on your farm no matter what, because they're the bare minimum for producing safe produce. So even if you're not subject to an inspection, It's a good idea to understand what's in that law and make sure your farm is in compliance with that, whether you're going to be inspected or not.

Speaker 1:

In light of that, can you just maybe walk us through how different farmers that grow produce might approach food safety. What are some of the focuses that, that these audits or inspections are focusing on and also how that might apply to some of the smaller growers.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, it's kinda funny. Our motto for Farm Food Safety is "Keep poop off food". Sounds kind of crass. But essentially a lot of the contamination that gets on produce is from bacteria that are associated with feces. And so that's become really our focus is things like proper hand washing after using the bathroom, keeping animals out of the field or produce areas where there's produce being packed or stored or things like that. So obviously there's other risks too. So, we look at things like the water that's being used for washing produce, or irrigation. Making sure that the quality of that water is safe as it's getting applied to produce. There's a lot of just worker training that is required under this law. Making sure that workers know what it means to produce safe produce, and that they're trained to look out for areas where there might be hazards present and who to report that to, as well as basic hygiene and sanitation. Not going to work when you're sick, that's a really big thing. So, if anyone has any kind of symptoms of a foodborne illness, they should not be contacting produce at all. And so having protocols in place where if they are sick, they report that and they don't work that day, or they have a task on the farm that's not associated with produce at all. Maybe they're mowing the lawn that day, keeping illness off of food by keeping workers safe and healthy. And then making sure that if there are wild animals coming onto the farm because farms are part of nature, right? We're kind of keeping an eye on that. We know we can't completely exclude animals from a field. But before produce is harvested, taking a look to see if there's any evidence that there had been animals there, maybe not harvesting that portion of the crop if you find evidence of that. And then just general cleaning and sanitizing of equipment that's used at harvesting, that's used in packing and storing produce. Maintaining proper temperatures for produce of some things are harvested in the heat of the day and you may need to cool that down. So, there's a lot of different aspects to consider, but those are some of the main ones, I would say.

Speaker 1:

As you're going over these, I'm thinking about some of the programs that we do with food handlers for that maybe work in a restaurant or some other environment where we're serving food. Maybe it's a hospital setting or something like that. And so much of it aligns with that. And in a lot of it, going back to the hand hygiene, we just can't stress how important that is enough. And it's across the board, isn't it? I mean, it's starting with the farm and going all the way to eating your food.

Speaker 2:

So yeah, that's probably the number one thing we want folks to take away is hand hygiene and all of the different times where you need to wash your hands before handling product.

Speaker 1:

I think about growing up in a rural area and seeing some fields where produce was grown, and now when you travel around the country, sometimes you can see like the outhouses and also the hand wash station where I feel like that wasn't something that was really common years ago. And so I think that's one good example of how when they're working in the fields, whether it's maintaining the crops or harvesting, there's much more of a focus now than what there was.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, definitely. I see them too. I live in blueberry country and there's always field sanitation units. That's kind of the official term for them. So, there'll be affordable hand-washing station, portable toilets that are accessible to the workers. And that is not only a food safety requirement, it's also an OSHA requirement as well. And so, it's important that all workers have access to crop or toilet facilities and hand-washing facilities. And one of the things we really stressed too is making sure those are clean, sanitary, and making sure that they're stocked with soap and paper towels and all of those things that they need to make sure they're safe.

Speaker 1:

And it's also like that in the kitchen. I mean, you can't just have a sink and say, we're all set but we want to also have the equipment there, the soap, the towels, the garbage, but also the oversight to make sure it's done appropriately.

Speaker 2:

So again, growers are the first step in the food safety supply chain, but everybody has a responsibility, right? So, the growers are going to do everything in their power to make sure that that food leaving the door is as safe as possible. But then there's a lot of steps before that gets to your kitchen. It requires folks that are transporting, storing, aggregating that product, and then retailing that product, they all have to follow the law as well. So, the Food Safety Modernization Act, or FISMA, also has requirements around transportation, storage, food facilities, if any of that food is getting processed in An additional step, I think one thing to take away is that this law is really trying to be comprehensive of the entire supply chain. And everybody across that supply chain down to the consumer has a responsibility to keep that food safe because it passes through a lot of hands along the way and there's always opportunities for it to become unsafe. So, it's really important that everybody in that whole chain understands food safety and is doing everything they can to maintain the safety of that product.

Speaker 1:

A lot of opportunities throughout the whole process. As listeners. Now, we've talked a lot about what produce growers do, like more at the commercial level, but let's make this a little bit more personal. And how can maybe listeners take the information you've provided and apply it to their home garden.

Speaker 2:

I think just like you shared how it translates to food service. That definitely all translates to a home garden as well. So, it's kinda starting with that hand washing piece. Before you harvest the food from your garden, wash your hands and make sure that you're harvesting it into a clean container. And as you're bringing it inside, putting it on a clean surface. Just those basic cleaning and sanitation steps apply no matter what scale of produce production we're talking about. Also keeping animals out of the field. If you have pets, keeping them out of your garden. I know a lot of people who have backyard chickens or you might have some small livestock on your, on your house. We always encourage farmers, if they have livestock, to separate those tasks. And by separate those tasks, a number of different things. So maybe it's doing the produce activities first. And if you can't do that, because a lot of times animals need to be fed first thing in the morning, that means completely decontaminate yourself prior to doing that next activity, right. So that could include things like separate, wearing separate clothes and footwear that you designate only for working with animals, washing your hands between those tasks. Those are the important things there. And if you have pets, wash your hands after you pet your dog or your cat, and you don't want that to contaminate your produce.

Speaker 1:

I think of some of the tools that in my own personal life, like we might use. Just our small little garden that we, that we used to have. But picking up pet feces in the yard. The equipment that you're using for that., make sure it's different than what you're using in the garden.

Speaker 2:

Exactly, if you only have one shovel than you could clean and sanitize that shovel in between tasks and then you're okay. But ideally, you would want to have a designated tool for each of those tasks. 

Speaker 1:

Sure. You're working in the dirt. We still want to maintain that level of cleanliness. Absolutely. This is one thing too. We can just maybe have a back-and-forth conversation with. But so many people pick their produce, they want to wash it off right away. As food safety educator, we usually are talking to consumers about waiting until you're ready to consume that. Can you enlighten our listeners a little bit as far as what? What's the reason behind that?

Speaker 2:

I think in terms of washing produce, you want it to be right before you eat the produce, because that's the moment that it's about to go into your body.

Speaker 1:

And that's in relation to the protective coatings that are on some of the produce. So, if we watch those off, they might be more susceptible to some of the pathogens in the environment. Also, we can make them more susceptible to break down quicker by introducing that water and taking off some of those protective layers. So, they might like strawberries, for example may mold really quickly, and also leave some other nutrient content if we are washing them off in advance. So that's one thing, I think to make sure people tried to brush off the dirt as much as possible and get it into a state where it's if it's something like a tuber that was grown in the ground, brush it off but hold off on washing.

Speaker 2:

A lot of times there are products that are just not washed at all on the farm. Sometimes it depends. It varies from farm to farm, but it has to do with that shelf-life a lot of times and maintaining the quality of the product. So, a lot of times like greens will be dunked in water right after they're harvested to make sure that they're crisp and that maintains the shelf-life and keeps it fresher longer. But a lot of times they're not actually washing the product, it's just a quick dunk. And berries are really never washed at all on the farm side.  Some of the root vegetables might go through a spray or a tumbler to get that initial dirt off.

Speaker 1:

I guess one thing that we haven't touched on a whole lot yet was pesticides.  In just talking to you, some people I know in my personal life and how they use pesticides and maybe they're not always following the instructions like they should. In talking about pesticides, we mean like weed control or maybe even something to keep certain pests off of plants. There are some, like tomato plants or something like that. I think just about the importance of timing and using appropriately.

Speaker 2:

Yeah, absolutely. This is something that farms deal with a lot too, but on a small scale. So, pesticides provide an opportunity for chemical food safety risk, which is pretty significant if they're not used properly. It's important to actually follow the instructions on the label of whatever product you're using. I think some people don't necessarily think about that or they think they may know how to use it, but it's actually required by law that chemicals are applied per the label. So, it's really important that you do read those because it will give you information. A lot of times home pesticides are already mixed up. You don't have to worry about mixing it with a certain ratio. But they will give you information on how soon it's safe to eat food after you've applied the chemical. And that's something you really want to pay attention to. Because if you don't pay attention to that, there may still be chemical residues left on the food that are unsafe levels. So, it's pretty important to listen to those, those instructions and to follow them to the T. The other thing with pesticides is storing them. Especially if you have young children in the home, those can present a pretty big risk. So, making sure that they're stored in an area that's not accessible to young children or pets, potentially on a high shelf or locked up or something like that is something that's pretty important to consider as well.

Speaker 1:

Great reminders. Thank you. I really have enjoyed talking with you. I think you've given a lot of really important information that we can all take, even on a personal level. And I would like to direct people to one great resource that you are a team through MSU Extension has produced in it is podcasts that we call Produce Bites. Can you tell people where to find that?

Speaker 2:

Yeah. So, we have a website called Agrifood Safety on the MSU Extension website, and there is a subsection of that called Produce Bites. So, if you go to our MSU Extension website and just type either Agrifood Safety or Produce Bites in the search bar. You can find that pretty easily. And these are a series of short podcasts that a number of people from MSU Extension and our partners across the state have put together on different farm produce safety topics. I am there, there's all kinds of different topics. If you're interested in learning more, I get a lot of these would apply to a home garden as well. So, it's worth taking a look if you're a gardener or if you're just interested in farm food safety.

Speaker 1:

Yeah, I've found them to be really educational, credibly educational. And you've got some great resources and great experts that you interviewed. And I would encourage anybody that wants to find out more. This is a great starting point, I think. So. Thank you very much for your time.

Speaker 2:

Thanks for having me, Kara. This was fun.

Speaker 1:

MSU is in affirmative action. Equal opportunity employer. Michigan State University Extension programs and materials are open to all without regard to race, color, national origin, gender, gender identity, religion, age, height, weight, disability, political beliefs, sexual orientation, marital status, family status, or veteran status. This information is for educational purposes only. Reference to commercial products or trade names does not imply endorsement by MSU Extension or bias against those mentioned.

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  Kara Lynch

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  Mariel Borgman